Author Topic: Petition started for "compromise" on 34th Ave Open Streets  (Read 13835 times)

Offline StevenGrey

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Re: Petition started for "compromise" on 34th Ave Open Streets
« Reply #195 on: September 15, 2021, 08:40:58 PM »
Let's be realistic. Traffic fatalities have risen dramatically since the onset of the pandemic because of the nonsense of open streets, bike boulevards, and outdoor dining sheds. Not because the drivers have suddenly gotten any worse behind the wheel, but because all of these programs create chaos on our roads and cut down on the visibility of pedestrians and cyclists. Frustrate or confuse drivers with narrowed traffic lanes, new traffic patterns, or obstacles that simple shouldn't be there (such as the dining sheds) and it should come as no surprise that collisions and fatalities are on the rise. To blame this solely on the drivers is an oversimplification of the problem.

https://images.squarespace-cdn.com/content/v1/5cab9d9b65a707a9b36f4b6c/1626821479535-C8Z0SRUBPFFPTNJX9OJV/Chart+showing+the+rolling+12+month+fatality+count+under+Mayor+de+Blasio+with+a+decrease+from+Jan.+2015+until+mid-2018+and+an+increase+since+then?format=2500w

Offline JHHD

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Re: Petition started for "compromise" on 34th Ave Open Streets
« Reply #196 on: September 15, 2021, 10:06:37 PM »
Your claim that traffic fatalities are rising because of open streets, bike boulevards, and dining sheds is ludicrous.
Fatalities are up because drivers are confused by traffic patterns or fixed structures on the shoulder of the road? On what planet does that even sound reasonable? Do traffic fatalities go up wherever there is road construction?

Perhaps you haven't noticed the plague of reckless driving, the rampant failure to yield to pedestrians, the lack of any significant police enforcement, or the proliferation of bogus and often expired temporary plates i.e. unregistered and uninsured vehicles that flout laws with near impunity.
Here's some stats regarding the lack of enforcement. You can find the raw data here https://www1.nyc.gov/site/nypd/stats/traffic-data/traffic-data-archive-2021.page

In June, 2021 (the last month for which there are full-month stats), cops citywide wrote just 39,777 total moving violation tickets, which is down 51 percent from the 82,229 moving violations cops wrote in June 2019. Specifically, in June, 2021, cops wrote:

    2,308 failure-to-yield tickets (down 55 percent from 5,208 in June 2019)
    7,777 speeding tickets (down 35 percent from 11,993 in June 2019)
    2,623 tickets for running a red light (down 56 percent from 5,933 in June 2019)
    1,882 tickets for improper turn (down 72 percent from 6,857 in June 2019)

Through Sept. 1, 172 people have been killed on the roadways — including 80 pedestrians and 17 cyclists or micro-mobility users.
Yes, based on the numbers it surely must be because of the opens streets, bike boulevards, and curbside dining shacks /S. 

Offline StevenGrey

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Re: Petition started for "compromise" on 34th Ave Open Streets
« Reply #197 on: September 16, 2021, 01:16:10 PM »
There's clearly no point in trying to engage with you further on this matter since we are both firmly entrenched in our positions.

As you previous stated, people only see what they want to see and that is certain true for you and other members of the anti-car crowd. Maybe if you owned a car and drove these city streets as I do, you'd be more aware of all the pedestrians and cyclists who ignore their own safety, common sense, and the rules of the road, placing themselves and others in danger.

Just curious if the NYPD keeps data on tickets given to cyclists and pedestrians? Maybe more enforcement there would help, no?

Offline JHHD

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Re: Petition started for "compromise" on 34th Ave Open Streets
« Reply #198 on: September 16, 2021, 04:00:33 PM »
I'm not anti-car. I own a car, use it regularly, park it on the street, and have driven in this city my entire life. I also happen to respect the safety and needs of other road user, and see many many drivers who simply do not.
The fact that you don't seem to distinguish the difference in damage potential between someone is a 3-4k lb steel box vs someone on a 30lb bicycle is very telling.

Offline StevenGrey

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Re: Petition started for "compromise" on 34th Ave Open Streets
« Reply #199 on: September 16, 2021, 05:11:46 PM »
All the more reason pedestrians and cyclists should obey traffic signals and the rules of the road. All of your statements here make it seem as if car drivers are always the guilty party when that is simply not the case.

And I don't care for your tone or demeanor on here, so this is the end of my following of this thread. It's very telling that you know your arguments are thin.

Offline CaptainFlannel

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Re: Petition started for "compromise" on 34th Ave Open Streets
« Reply #200 on: September 17, 2021, 09:17:10 AM »
Quote
Traffic fatalities have risen dramatically since the onset of the pandemic because of the nonsense of open streets, bike boulevards, and outdoor dining sheds

How does the chart posted from Transportation Alternatives support the claim of causality? (It doesn't)

Offline hfm

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Re: Petition started for "compromise" on 34th Ave Open Streets
« Reply #201 on: September 18, 2021, 12:08:37 AM »
There's clearly no point in trying to engage with you further on this matter since we are both firmly entrenched in our positions.

As you previous stated, people only see what they want to see and that is certain true for you and other members of the anti-car crowd. Maybe if you owned a car and drove these city streets as I do, you'd be more aware of all the pedestrians and cyclists who ignore their own safety, common sense, and the rules of the road, placing themselves and others in danger.

Just curious if the NYPD keeps data on tickets given to cyclists and pedestrians? Maybe more enforcement there would help, no?

This is quite true. I own a car but don't use it very often. The amount of times a pedestrian just wandered into the intersection against the light as I'm coming to it consistently takes me aback. There's been a couple that have stared me down as they are doing it like they aren't the one doing something wrong. There's enough blame here to go all around for making mistakes whether intentional or not. I'm hyper vigilant when I'm driving, but there's not much I can do about people who don't also follow the rules or think they can just bend them if it seems safe to.

Offline earbears

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Re: Petition started for "compromise" on 34th Ave Open Streets
« Reply #202 on: September 21, 2021, 10:59:10 AM »
If you are having issues with the Open Street and want a COMPROMISE, please check out this site. If you agree with what is said, please sign the petition



https://www.34compromise.org/about

Offline CaptainFlannel

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Re: Petition started for "compromise" on 34th Ave Open Streets
« Reply #203 on: September 21, 2021, 11:52:21 AM »
Similarly, if you like 34th Avenue Open Street, and would like to see improvements made for pedestrian and cyclist safety, accessibility, space and programs for public schools, etc., be sure to check out this petition: https://www.34avelinearpark.com/

Jackson Heights Life

Re: Petition started for "compromise" on 34th Ave Open Streets
« Reply #203 on: September 21, 2021, 11:52:21 AM »